Richard M. Nixon

[c| Dr. NO]

http://www.whitehouse.gov/history/presidents/rn37.html

If it wasent for the wateragate scandal i believe this man would be praised a hell of a lot more for his accomplishments as president.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

You are probably right.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Yes, he was one of the greatest Presidents this country has had.  Unfortunately, the only thing he did different from every other President is to not know how to properly cover up the crap that his party was doing.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Ghost, he had knowledge that they were doing wrong, his biggest crime was that he let them.  He had the election locked up already, so that break in was pure stupidity.

And while he wasn't as bad as his rep, I would not go so far as to call him one of the greatest.  In this small of group, the top 10% is only 4 guys.  He wouldn't get mentioned in my top 8. In not much of an order you have: Teddy, Wodrow and Jimmy, the only three to win the Nobel Peace Prize, amongst other great things they did, you have FDR and Ike, Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln (the other three guys on the mountain with Teddy).  

Besides, much of what good happened while Nixon was president was due to Kissinger, in my opinion.

I just agree that he wasn't as bad as Watergate has stained his reputation.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

In this small of group, the top 10% is only 4 guys.  He wouldn't get mentioned in my top 8. In not much of an order you have: Teddy, Wodrow and Jimmy, the only three to win the Nobel Peace Prize, amongst other great things they did, you have FDR and Ike, Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln (the other three guys on the mountain with Teddy).

Oh Bucc, I know you will just love my top picks of Greatest Presidents:

1.  George Washington

2.  Thomas Jefferson

3.  Abraham Lincoln

4.  Ronald Reagan

5.  Theodore Roosevelt

6.  George W. Bush (oh, I can feel the scorn now)

7.  Dwight D. Eisenhower

8.  James Madison

Sorry, but FDR never ranks high on my lists....for all the good he did, most of the problems with the social programs in the country today are his fault.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

In this small of group, the top 10% is only 4 guys.  He wouldn't get mentioned in my top 8. In not much of an order you have: Teddy, Wodrow and Jimmy, the only three to win the Nobel Peace Prize, amongst other great things they did, you have FDR and Ike, Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln (the other three guys on the mountain with Teddy).

Oh Bucc, I know you will just love my top picks of Greatest Presidents:

1.  George Washington

2.  Thomas Jefferson

3.  Abraham Lincoln

4.  Ronald Reagan

5.  Theodore Roosevelt

6.  George W. Bush (oh, I can feel the scorn now)

7.  Dwight D. Eisenhower

8.  James Madison

Sorry, but FDR never ranks high on my lists....for all the good he did, most of the problems with the social programs in the country today are his fault.

What the hell has George W actually accomplished that would make him one of the greatest?  Increase the deficit?  Spin lots of lies to the public to advocate a war (not that he was the first or only, but that's not great in my opinion).

And problems today with the social programs from FDR's times are the fault of later and current administrations.  If they couldn't keep up with the times it's because the administrations failed to administrate them.  Changing times call for changes, after all.

Ronnie Raygun falls just under JFK for me.  Both took us to the brink of a nuclear war, and both got us out of it.  One did it without putting us in the hole by billions, though it was a more final solution.

Why Madison?

[BTs_FahQ2]

I must say as a president Nixon was a dolt.  He blundered his first bid for election with a long list of bad decisions and getting stomped on in result.  Then he moved on to make unfullfilled promises and some of the stupidest foreign affairs decisions we have seen.

But when you talk of Nixon the ambassador.  This man pails most in comparison.  He did more with are relations with china then anyone could have at a time when war was getting ready to roll again.  I think his efforts after his presidency well made up for his incumbent stupidity and attached value once again to a man who made so many strifes to raise to the lever at which he did.  I mean, in these modern times you should see where the guy grew up.  His childhood home was pretty much the same as lincoln's but some 80 years later.  

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Why Madison?

James Madison, 4th President of the United States, Because:

1.  He was father of the U.S. Constitution (done before he was President, I know).

2.  Got us through the 2nd Major war we fought against Great Britain (The War of 1812), which was the last time this nation was nearly destroyed by a foreign country (last time an enemy invaded our soil).

3.  During the War of 1812, Madison held the distinction of being the first President (and the last) to come under enemy fire while in office.

4.  Helped frame the the Bill of Rights (also before he became President).

5.  The New England Federalists who had opposed the war--and who had even talked secession--were so thoroughly repudiated that Federalism disappeared as a national party.


After his death in 1836, a note he had written was found that included the following statement (this was at a time when secession of certain states was becomming a problem again):

"The advice nearest to my heart and deepest in my convictions is that the Union of the States be cherished and perpetuated."

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Yeah, but I don't count the stuff that was done before he was president, that just makes him a great statesman, not a great president.  And there are a slough of them in that category.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Yeah, but I don't count the stuff that was done before he was president, that just makes him a great statesman, not a great president.  And there are a slough of them in that category.

Okay, okay, I admit it!  I put Madison on there because I was absolutely NOT going to put FDR, Carter, or Clinton on MY list!  lol

[Ace]

I'm sorry, but anyone who would put GW and Madison on their list to avoid mentioning FDR is a complete and utter fucking idiot.

But hey, that's just my two cents.

[BTs_FahQ2]

Sorry ghost, I have to agree FDR is up in the top 3 for me

[BTs_GhostSniper]

I'm sorry, but anyone who would put GW and Madison on their list to avoid mentioning FDR is a complete and utter fucking idiot.

But hey, that's just my two cents.

No, I didn't put George Bush on my list to avoid putting FDR, just Madison.  I really believe that George Bush is one of our greatest Presidents (and hey, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh agree with me!).

FDR was a great wartime President.  He has also been called America's only dictator (partly for the way he ran and was elected 4 times, and partly for the way he ran the country internally during the war).  If you guys think the Patriot Act is bad, you absolutely would not want to have been around in this country during WWII if you were anything but Caucasion and born and raised here.  EVERYONE else was under great scrutiny, and if you were Japanese, forget about it....to the internment camps you go!

Peace.

-GhostSniper Out.

[alaric]

(and hey, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh agree with me!).

If anything would give me a good reason to reconsider my stance on a topic, that would be it.

My top three:

Teddy
FDR
Lincoln

From here on out it gets fuzzy. There have certainly been other good, even great presidents, but none of the rest come close to these three.

[cO.Kuza]

My top three
1.) John F. Kennedy
2.) George washington
3.) good ol' abe

[|MP|Buccaneer]

FDR was also a great peace time president, or he wouldn't have served so many terms.  He did a great deal to pull us out of the great depression, you know.

And what do you have against Carter?  The fact that he brought a peace between Israel and Egypt (he should have gotten the thrid Nobel Peace Prize for that), That he had the balls to go to Three Mile Island and help stop the nuclear meltdown?  Or the fact that the delta force can't seem to fly through a desert while he was Prez?

Do me a favor, list the greatest 10 things George W has done as president for me.  

BTW, we are supposed to be a bit more enlightened over the past 50 years, so while we see the interment camps of WW2 as a bad thing now, we should learn enough from it not to pull shit like the Patriot Act, which has resulted in American Citizens not even being allowed to talk to family or lawyers for 2 years.  There is nothing at all you can say that makes the Patriot Act less un-American than it most obviously is.  "Give us liberty, or give us death."  George would choose to give us death.