why, why, WHY!?!?

[Brain]

Ok, I have a fairly high tolerance for things, but this has gone out of hand.  Every time I log onto the forum I see more and more shit being flung around, and frankly I want to say something before I have to go get a snorkel.

I?ve determined that the root of the problem is that nobody here wants to drop a point. Buccaneer doesn't want to leve one of Bondo?s posts unrefuted, and Bondo wants to prove Buccaneer wrong.  The same thing is going on with many people on these forums all the time.  This shit storm has started to even pervade the black ops section, the place that was set aside for those who want to have a real debate could do so with out putting up with pointless spam and baseless/tasteless personal attacks.

You people need to take a step back and look at how asinine and childish your actions have become.  Learn to let something just die for once. A good example is Rapid's accusation of an "inner circle".  We have heard this accusation since last year, and still nobody has provided any evidence to support this claim.  Every time Rapid doesn?t get his way on these boards, the inner circle is to blame, no if's, and's, or but's.  Just drop it already man, please.

Or how bout the Buccaneer vs. Bondo thing that has shown up recently. Buccaneer doesn?t like Bondo?s method of arguing his points, and asked to know where it came from.  Bondo has ignored this request, and simply started an argument that appears the only serve to draw attention from this request. Buccaneer hasn?t relented.  Why not do the simple thing and have Bondo answer the original question, and have both of you start with a clean slate? If you cant do that, just don?t respond to one another?s posts. I know for a fact that both of you are intelligent enough to have come up with this solution on your own. My big question is why not?

I know that for most of you this is just a minor annoyance, but I?m a moderator, and I need to read every single new post that is made in order to make sure there isn?t anything grossly offensive or illegal contained in said posts. Because of this, I have the unwelcome pleasure of being exposed to the full force of the current shit storm every day, and frankly I?m getting tired of it. If this shit doesn?t stop soon, I?m going to tell Mauti to find another moderator and leave the damn boards for good. Not semi-retirement like loud notes, but I mean gone for good (although I might check back in about 5 years to see if things have changed any).

This might sound like I?m being high and mighty, or like I?m pulling a ?holier than thou? act, but I am serious about this. I?ve seen what is going on from an objective standpoint (just try and find a post where I take a real strong side for one person or another in the Buccaneer Vs. Bondo bitch out, or a recent post where I am insulting Rapid or another combatant in this shit slinging contest). It really has gotten to the point where I am considering resigning from these boards.

All I?m saying is that it?s time you, ALL of you, took a step back and see what you have turned this forum into. Who knows, you might just see what I?m seeing. If you can?t, well, let me tell you that it is not pretty, and the future doesn?t look any brighter

-Brain


P.S.  I would apreciate it if the other mods would not delete or unsticky this for a few days.  I think it's important enough for everyone to see

[Typhy]

At this point, I think that it may be best to just start a new forum called "Bucc vs Bondo". I agree with Brain 100%. I have nothing against intelligent arguing. What I dislike is when certian people feel a need to attack someone else on everything that they do. Please, only argue about it if you actually care about it.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Ok, this question is to the both of you then Brain and Typhy.

Where do I post that I don't care about?  I don't post in 90% of the threads here.  Because I either don't know or don't care about them.

Also Brain, is it necessary to be so melodramatic about this?  A simple post like Loudnote's is fine to get your point across, don't you think?  Like you said, the issues between Bondo and I have sprung up just of late, so it seems funny to me that I'm at the center of your pain.

Honestly, what happened to the "take care of this in private messages" attitude that was shown in the attack on Ace thread?

And Typhy, I started a new thread just to try to keep that bullshit out of other threads.  

[Brain]

first, i dont recall ever saying you didnt care, i might be wrong, but i dont think i ever said that.

2ndly, yes it is necessary, because that is how i feel. if this shit doesnt stop in the gg and black ops(you and bondo were just an examle) i'm going to leave
the main thorn in my side is the constang mind numbing blathering  that i read though every day

the reason this isnt in a pm is because there are more people that i amadressing than the 3 of you i mensioned in my  post

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Brain, you didn't say it, but it was a question to you just the same.  I've run into two guys here that are so clueless as to aggrivate me, and in 3 or 4 threads, those conversations have gone one.  But in the other handful of threads I post in, there's none of the problems you mention.  And, since I don't post in many threads at all, I don't understand how I can be a large part of the focal point of your woes.

I don't want to see you go Brain, because we've had many a good discussion.  But if that's the way you feel about it, you probably should.  From the past reading I did, it doesn't look like the forums have taken a dip downhill at all.  Looks like this is pretty much the norm.  

And, if you were addressing more then 3 of us, you should have said so.  If it really is directed to more people, please, direct it to them.

[Brain]

ok, first off, i think that you do care where yu post, you arent a spammer, and when you do post you have something to say. i aprecciate that as a mod and as a member of this forum

secondly you aren't the focal point. you are just the unfortunate last straw. i see a lot of shit every day as a mod, and frankly i needed to vent. your post along with bondo and rapid's were the last 3 posts i read before i typed this

i was adressing the form as a whole, but i obviously didnt state that clearly enough, and i appolgise (god i cant spell) for that

about the whole leavving thing, i think that has to do with the fact that i think i bombed a test yesterday. i'm gonna get some sleep, and see how i feel in the morning.

[Ace]

As the one who has been around here longest as a mod, I must say right now is not nearly as bad as it could be. Yes, there have been better times, but there's also been a lot worse. By agreeing to do this job for Mauti, you should have realized that all it is a good majority of the time is wading through stinky piles of shit. The thing is if Bondo, Bucc, or whoever it may be wants to go off now, it's generally in an acceptable manner. Outside of maybe one or two things, the only problems lately have been SK spamming and Rapid being... well, Rapid.

[*NADS Capt. Anarchy]

First off, i'd like to say that with the rise of the "special forces" there really IS an inner circle. God only know what they do under their cloak of secrecy. I wouldn't be half surprised if they had giganto man-orgies(hope no offense, Bondo, though you might enjoy that ) twice a week.

I have to second what bucc said... why all the drama? sure, we've got problems, but oh well. so be it. we'll still live.

-takes a step back-

I see a forum. I see your average human community. You have a few good guys, a few bad guys, and the faceless masses. I don't see more mudslinging than i would expect, but there's enough to keep those who enjoy flame wars happy.

As for the mudslinging and such, just let it go. It'll always be there, and frankly life would be a lot more boring without it. If you can't take all the shit, just resign your position as a mod. I mean, sheesh. It's like retiring is the hot thing ot do these days.  No need to leave entirely, you could still visit and post on the topics you would want too, and you wouldn't have to read all the shit. And it wouldn't be the end of the world, i'm sure they could scrape up another mod somewhere.

Want some attention and a little less regret,
A teenage fluff, little threat.
And there are those, there are those who think
That drastic actions will make them unique.
It's really all the same,
That no one's happy and nobody's to blame.
And the moral to this story is old.
It's quite taboo, seldom told

no need for drastic actions, man.

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Brain, sounds like it's the bombing of the test getting to ya.  Do what all good (and bad) upper's do at that time.  Get drunk.  

Don't worry about this thread.  Chalk it up to a bad day and bad moods.  Have some Everclear and a smile, and a snow cow.  They shouldn't have their winter coat of fat yet (well, not their winter coat of it, the summer coat is still there).

[AK_Rap1d]

Well brain, if you sat in my shoes and saw the abuse, you'd be hella pissed off.  Probably way worse than me.  Lucky I'm more passive than most, or it would be all out war.  When I been looked at, as some sort of problem, yet nobody can mention what the real problem is, other than their disagreements with me on past issues, which I properly handled and cleared myself and my clan from, it's disgusting to see the treatment and negative gossip that is spread about me in counter-attack of them feeling so "defeated".  I always present myself to all issues and handle manners with equal treatment given to me.  Hell, I felt so bad on my past competitive differences with Grifter, that I dedicated him a page and spread his good word to others in remorse to have always battled.  Then when new times come and things seem to have cleared and I come around the "community" and I get treated badly, as if that's needed from any of these people, it just disgusts me to see these people act like such "angels".  From getting denied to host in MacClans, to having my ?ngels post deleted, to having my threads locked where I ask for help on web hosting, to having my posts deleted when I speak my stance on issues I was addressed in with the MacClans with Bucc.  It's all abuse.  And it's an abuse that is hard to be taken from people who think they are righteous.  These people carry the devil in them with all the negative energy they push onto me.  They try and portray me as some bad person that doesn't deserve no privileges and should be exempt.  This is total discrimination and abuse.  Of course to them is just everyday ways of letting of some grudgeful steam to feel superior.  It's pathetic and everybody needs to be properly  informed of these actions.  Sure it's easy to try and point the finger at me as if I've caused problems when I defend myself, but that's just ignorance shouting over logic.  I've properly presented myself in all situations and have showed that I can fight fire with fire in any situation and that is offensive to some.  I don't mean to offend nobody.  I only defend myself and my clan with Knowledge and Facts.  Of course since I'm no 10 year old forum poster,  I "don't know as much as these others".  Yet I always properly prove my points.  I've taken enough abuse and it's time you put on some glasses and stopped being blind.  I know you Brain and we play RS all the time and have fun.  What these people around here are doing is polluting our clean water and clean ways of posting.  I can't do nothing cuz I'm being abused in any form possible for my strong opinions.  I've changed a lot on my post manners and have seen nothing in return, but more rude mother fuckers trying to get  a reaction.  It's time change comes to these forums and it's in the form of moderators.  You got a gasp of what's going on and you can only see so much.  If you sat in my shoes, and watched yourself get denied to host your clan's website, and then got your posts deleted over and over for NO REASON, other than pissed off opposite fans that happen to be mods, you would not sit there and take it.  I know you, you'd say something.  Now get a grip of the situation and help out the cause.  Tell others that their abuse is not acceptable.  It only fires up people and that's NOT the moderators job.  I'm tired now, but I'll post more as necessary later.  take care, -Rapid-

[Shade]

Im with typhy on this one. Arguements are fine  as long as they stay in THAT post... flame wars are just childish though

[Bondo]

I've run into two guys here that are so clueless as to aggrivate me, and in 3 or 4 threads, those conversations have gone one.

See, this is what bugs me...Bucc with his high-minded attitude that these two guys (be a man Bucc and say that you mean Zait and I) are clueless.  Yet he thinks he is not the problem on these forums.  Sorry, but when I debate with people with manners, it remains in control, but when they are like Bucc and feel the need to insult, there is no way for the thread not to become a flame war.

Oh and Bucc, the "attack on Ace" thread...it wasn't an attack, it was a complaint.  But since you two are members of the "Forum Circle" that Rapid always likes to talk about, you would want to distort it.  There may not be an actual conversation between this "Circle" but there are a handful of you who are united in your style and are a problem to this forum...so Rapid isn't so far off.

I'd hate to see you go Brain, you were one of the good moderators...I think the better solution rather is to get rid of the problem (those that insult others for their opinions).

[Brain]

ok, i'm actually semi coherent now. and looking back at last night, i cant really believe that i typed that long ass thing. i had already taken bucc's advice(it wasnt ever clear though)  and was sligly smashed(dented?) when i wrote that. hell, i'm amazae it's that coherent

so, while i was thinking almost everything, it didnt come out as tactfully as it could have.

i guess i needed to vent due to the stresses in my life. hope you didnt mind too much

and captian anarchy, you have no idea how close to right you are

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Brain, the air is clear on this side.  We have no problems.  Did you take the advise on the snow cow too?

Rapid and Bondo, I'm taking my own advise (which I tried already) and the advise of others here.  If you want to talk about me, bash me, or argue these points with me, there's a thread for that, or start a new one.  I'm not addressing it in every other thread I post in.

[Brain]

nah, didnt take the advice on the snowcows. i didnt want to get trampled or suffocated. i was pissed off, not suicidal

[Flame]

I think that arguments are alright, as long as they are on topic of the thread (which should be a good thread, not an argument thread) and not flame wars. If you want to start an argument thread, there should be another section on this forum that allows those-and does not count posts which delete the amount of spam.

[Deadeye]

brain: stop the madness!
typhy: what he said!  this is my chance to get on this train.
buccaneer: someone tell me why this is my fault?
rapid: blah blah blah, forum inner circle, blah blah blah, nobody respects me, blah , i don't do anything wrong.
bondo: whine whine whine, you are mean to me, sob sob sob, i can't be wrong, sniff sniff, it's his fault.
ace: welcome to life in the forums.

ok, i think this thread can be closed now.  all fronts have once again been heard from.  

[jn.loudnotes]

Wait for me!

I've a couple of things to add.  First, the simple posts I made didn't really get noticed, so I think Brain is on the right track with this thread.  

Yeah, there's quite a bit of overreacting, but I think the general point everyone needs to recognize is that while this is a human community, it is a controlled one.  

So in our disagreements, let's at least try to be civil, and let some false argument slide instead of hacking it into oblivion.  That only serves to stir up ill will, and after awhile it really isn't entertaining.

On that note, Rapid, we would all most appreciate if you would cease whining.  And if you must do so, please break your paragraphs instead of writing in one long sentence.

Bondo and Bucc, please give it a rest for now.  Thanks.

[jn.loudnotes]

And to continue from the thread that was locked because it got onto MacClans arguments again. . .

Bucc, high-minded as it may be, you've missed my point.  If Bondo is so much stupider than you, why are you insulted by his insignificant opinion.  And if his opinion is important enough to you that it upsets you when he won't concede, why do you belittle him for that?

Generally I try to spend more energy feeling sorry for people who I believe to be acting foolishly than I do attacking them for it.  Just a suggestion. . .

[|MP|Buccaneer]

Loudnotes, I hear what you are saying, but I'm just not a very sympathetic person.  I'm not heartless, nor cruel, but I'm not real sympathetic either.  My reaction is based upon being offended.  Probably because some unfortunate people here may actually believe that there are two schools of logic.  People like Zaitsev, who think that because Bondo shares most of their opinions, then they can't be wrong.  It's probably compounded because Bondo keeps throwing arguments back at me which make it obvious (and he's even said it) that he didn't read my posts fully.  That's pretty insulting to me.

But, as I said, I am going to try hard to keep it contained to the threads where it belongs.  And if it keeps getting worse, I'll just start acting like he actually did carry out his threat and leave these forums for his other two.  In other words, I'll just pretend his posts don't exist.

I hope this explains why I both didn't miss your point, and why, even though I do think he behaves like an idiot, it still bothers me.  Oh, and it's not "stupider".  I've never claimed to be smarter then anyone here.  I leave those claims to people like Zaitsev.  I just claimed to have a degree in which Logic was a fundimental part.