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BFG
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« Reply #40 on: October 08, 2004, 06:26:59 pm »

Cool, GS this is one of those moments when the clouds part and for a brief moment... We both agree on somthing Wink
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« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2004, 12:25:14 am »

GhostSniper...a lot of the posts in this thread were geared toward changing your point of view or asking you to try to explain yourself better.  I'm all for shutting up in general, but I'm curious why you haven't addressed any of the points raised against you?
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« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2004, 01:50:21 am »

GhostSniper...a lot of the posts in this thread were geared toward changing your point of view or asking you to try to explain yourself better.  I'm all for shutting up in general, but I'm curious why you haven't addressed any of the points raised against you?

Fine dickhead...list point by point exactly what it is you want me to address and I will respond.[/size]
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« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2004, 06:12:38 am »

Sigh...can't you just go back and read?  I've said this three times already.  Quoting two of my posts, each of which have questions in them:

Quote
Ghostsniper, I'm not sure why your wife's views are so out of keeping with the majority of her countrymen.? Besides, "how" they were using the words is irrelevant - they addressed them to Civic, who is German.? How was he supposed to interpret them?
---

Background
Nazism and WWII are naturally still very sensitive subjects for both Germans and Austrians (and according to Anschluss, which was one of the "justifications" Hitler used for his expansion into Austria, there is no difference between the two nations).? Typhy is completely wrong to express no sympathy for a German called a Nazi - on the contrary, to be called a Nazi, as a German or Austrian, is an extraordinary insult.? Furthermore, to insinuate that modern Germans in some way share culpability for the events of WWII is ludicrious and offensive.

Bans without warning
It's not off topic to address the obvious reason you should not lightly compare a German or Austrian to a Nazi.? It gives some context for the bans.? It is and should be common knowledge that this background information is self-evident.? No warning should be necessary for totally exceeding the bounds of sensitivity and decency.?

I don't even live in Europe, but I speak German and have studied the culture because my family too was affected in WWII.? I completely see where Mauti is coming from - perhaps this will reinforce for those banned the importance of some cultural sensitivity.? Finally, its hardly dictatorial to ban people for egregious personal attacks, when there are warnings all over the place against flaming.? Nazi simply crossed an unwritten line.? BFG summed it up pretty concisely.

Quote
Ghost, why didn't you answer the questions I posed in my post instead of just pointing out a controversial statement?? Please take a moment to consider them before dismissing all the counter arguments against you.

Yes, I know Germany is different from the United States in their ban of the party, but you can't really compare the two.? Banning the party in Germany was the best way to insure that the same mistake will not be repeated.? It is a subject of national shame, and nobody there disagrees with the ban.? Even in this country we impose limits on freedom of speech - Nazism is just as (if not more) offensive to Germans as pornography on network television would be to you.? In any case, the United States does not have a similar issue in history that would prompt us to ban a political party.

The point isn't so much every line within these posts.  It's that you dismissed them (and BFG's) entirely with "sorry, but I don't agree."  No shit.  Why don't you say why and support your viewpoint if you have any counterarguments?
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« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2004, 07:18:10 am »

Sigh...can't you just go back and read?  I've said this three times already.

Because I actually have a life and during my busy day at work I often miss things that are written....or don't have time to respond to longer posts when I see them.  I also don't have a lot of time to go back and read through threads for stuff that I may have missed.[/size]

Ghostsniper, I'm not sure why your wife's views are so out of keeping with the majority of her countrymen.? Besides, "how" they were using the words is irrelevant - they addressed them to Civic, who is German.? How was he supposed to interpret them?

Yes, "how" the words were being used is very relevant.  The fact that those people weren't using the word "Nazi" to mean Civic is racist, a murderer, or guilty of war crimes does mean something.  In fact, to honestly think that Blitz, Crypt, or the others were actually saying it in that way is laughable.  They were saying that Civic is a dictator, no more.  And it is that context that my wife disagreed with her countrymen.  Also, whether or not Civic is a dictator or not, you will have to let those who were banned answer that.[/size]

Background
Nazism and WWII are naturally still very sensitive subjects for both Germans and Austrians (and according to Anschluss, which was one of the "justifications" Hitler used for his expansion into Austria, there is no difference between the two nations).? Typhy is completely wrong to express no sympathy for a German called a Nazi - on the contrary, to be called a Nazi, as a German or Austrian, is an extraordinary insult.? Furthermore, to insinuate that modern Germans in some way share culpability for the events of WWII is ludicrious and offensive.

No need to give me background on WWII...it was the emphasis of my History Degree.  Typhy can express whatever the hell he wants...you can't tell someone what they can or can not think or feel.  Ever hear of FREEDOM?  Telling someone they can't think a certain way was a hallmark of the Nazis.  So am I calling YOU a Nazi?  Of course not, but saying that makes you SOUND like a Nazi.  See the difference?  Also, modern Germans do not necessarily share culpability for the events of WWII, however, many of their family members do (mothers, fathers, grandmothers, grandfathers, etc).  And to say that none of those people spread their racist thoughts and feelings down through the generations of their family would be a lie.[/size]

Bans without warning
It's not off topic to address the obvious reason you should not lightly compare a German or Austrian to a Nazi.? It gives some context for the bans.? It is and should be common knowledge that this background information is self-evident.? No warning should be necessary for totally exceeding the bounds of sensitivity and decency.

I think that if those people in Germany and Austria don't want to be called Nazis, they should think about the way they act.  This forum is a prime example.  There is no community voice in anything done here.  Whatever Mauti, Flies, Civic, and some of the other admins wants is what goes.  The community that is the MAJORITY on this forum and in this League gets no say in anything.  Even those admin who run things are not voted on by the community.  So, when someone says this place is a dictatorship, that is why.  And then to ban someone for their first offense because it offends an admin is really out of line.  Hell, people have called me things in the forum that I have taken great offense to, but you didn't see any of them get banned.  Nice double standard.[/size]

Ghost, why didn't you answer the questions I posed in my post instead of just pointing out a controversial statement?? Please take a moment to consider them before dismissing all the counter arguments against you.

Again, I sometimes miss these things.  So sue me.[/size]

Nazis killed some of my family members during WWII.  Do you know what I take offense to?  Fucking Europeans who have no appreciation for America coming to their aid over and over during history....WWI, WWII, and most recently in the Balkans.  I take offense that some of the fucking liberals, Europeans, and socialists on this forum don't pay me the first fucking courtesy for going into Kosovo, being wounded, and losing some of my best friends because the FUCKING EUROPEANS wouldn't stand up to tyranny right in their BACK YARD.  So when you have gone into combat, when you have taken a bullet for your buddy, and when you have watched friends of yours die right in front of you....THEN you can come in here and tell me that calling someone a Nazi is this great crime against humanity![/size]
« Last Edit: October 09, 2004, 07:22:17 am by BTs_GhostSniper » Logged

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« Reply #45 on: October 09, 2004, 12:59:31 pm »

Oh for Fuck sake. Yes Ghostsniper we all know that you believe the rest of the world should be bowing down and worshiping America at every god damn moment. Of course people appreciate the help in WWII, you weren't the only country to go to war though... And its not exactly as if america just decided it would like to come and help Europe.. there were little things like Perl Harbour that had a little inpact! This bullshit about lack of appreciation etc is exactly that. Bullshit.

There is a difference beweeen calling someone a Dictator, and a Nazi.

If you want to call someone a Nazi go ahead - however that sort of personal insult  is however not tollerated on these forums hence the one week bans.

Regarding the community not having a view... more bullshit. Everything that people put forward and discuss is taken into account, and changes and inprovments are made as suggested and requested by the community - sometimes of course this can't happen, somtimes it does. If you genuinly believe there is no community voice i wonder where you have been all this time. A dictatorship is, by its defination dicated by one person. *DAMN Does not work that way.
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« Reply #46 on: October 09, 2004, 02:30:24 pm »

Thank you for clarifying your views, Ghostsniper.  I am perfectly aware of what it is like not to have time to fully respond to posts, but since you made several posts hence in this thread after a dismissal "I disagree," it appeared to be more a case of not having any good response.

Now, if you think its best to shut up already, I think we can all do that.
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« Reply #47 on: October 09, 2004, 04:02:01 pm »

Now, if you think its best to shut up already, I think we can all do that.

Absolutely....I really didn't want to go back down the track in my last post.  All it ever does is upset BFG.[/size]  Wink
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« Reply #48 on: February 17, 2005, 09:12:26 am »

Even if you are right Tiro, I removed your content because we don't need to warm up very old issue, do we?

Bye,

Mauti
« Last Edit: February 17, 2005, 12:52:12 pm by *DAMN Mauti » Logged

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« Reply #49 on: February 17, 2005, 04:26:44 pm »

I don't know what Tiro said in here, but I do think this is one of those times when a thread should be locked.  Would you please do the honors Mauti?

P.S.  I no longer feel the same way about the leadership of *DAMN that I did when this thread was started.
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"On the fields of friendly strife are sown the seeds that on other days and other fields will bear the fruits of victory."

-General of the Army Douglas MacArthur
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