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| | |-+  Are You Better Off Than 4 Years Ago?
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Question: Are You Better Off Than 4 Years Ago?
Better - 7 (35%)
Same - 3 (15%)
Worse - 10 (50%)
Total Voters: 20

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*DAMN Bondo
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« on: September 26, 2004, 02:30:19 am »

It is the clich?d political question, ?are you better off now than you were four years ago?? I can answer that question quickly with a no, but thinking long and hard, I actually conclude that where political influence on my life is concerned, I am the worst off I?ve ever been in my 22 years (rounding to the nearest year) of life. This is a life that has had 14 years of Republican Presidency and only Bill Clinton?s 8 years for the Democrats. Despite the flaws of Reagan and Bush 41, things were all right back then, just not as well as they should be. With Dubya though, it is literally the worst it has been?and has gotten worse with time.

Now, with the tragedy of 9/11 and the recession, a few things that were not completely avoidable by Bush, it would be natural to give him some leeway. If I felt that we were at least improving, it would give me hope that it was just bad political luck, but instead things have gone downhill.

We?ll start with the issue of foreign policy and homeland security. I literally feel more unsettled and unsafe as I write this than I did on September 12, 2001. While the attack exposed to the world that we were not secure, it also brought a wave of unity and support, both at home and abroad. That unity and the hope it presented was more powerful in making me feel safe than any ?Patriot Act? could.

Unfortunately, due specifically to the President?s actions, this unity and hope withered away and was replaced by dissention and even vast hatred or fear of the US. So much money has been spent on the war in Iraq especially, that homeland security measures are woefully under funded and incomplete. We are nearly as exposed to terrorism as we were on 9/11. When you add this to the effect of the Iraq War?increased terrorist attacks worldwide, increased terrorism recruitment, and increased terrorist support, I have no reason to feel safer now, and now we have none of the unity that would make it possible to effectively combat terrorism. For this we can directly blame Bush and his policies, he has made us less safe.

Politically, I feel things are in a bad state. Too often these days, if I try to do my patriotic duty of holding the government accountable for misdeeds, I am practically accused of treason. Since when has it become so anti-American to suggest that maybe we should try to avoid killing innocent civilians? When did it become wrong to point out the lies and deceptions coming from the Executive branch and wondering why no one is being held accountable for it? How can Donald Rumsfeld keep his position after the Iraq War miscalculation, the Abu Gharib scandal and human rights violations at Guantanamo Bay, not to mention his numerous horrible remarks that make the US look bad? Is it no longer my duty to protest when laws like the Patriot Act are passed that violate constitutional rights and limit our freedom that we are supposed to cherish above all things?

In front of my eyes, the United States has become a thuggish country that does not regard basic human rights and turns its back on the principles it was founded on. The US is failing to be the shining example to the world, something we desperately need to be if we are to have any credibility in establishing democracy in other nations. The US should be nothing less than the leader (leading by example) in civil liberties, human rights, and compassion.

In my mind, these issues are the most important in showing why the country is at its worst point of my life. Simple facts like more Americans dying because of terrorism or war during the past four years than any of the previous five terms. While Bush may not be worse in other areas than Reagan, just bad, he is worst in this area and thus overall.

While I can?t say I feel the country is really worse off on social issues than four years ago, after all, Clinton was responsible for passing the Defense of Marriage Act. I feel that, unlike the Democratic Party, Bush has been so religious and anti-gay rights and anti-choice (to mention another social issue) that he has actually caused regression by making these topics so divisive and seeking no middle ground, he has cleaved the country apart with his religious views, making everyone worse off.

Economically, I can?t point to any specific sign that I?m actually worse off because of Bush. In all likelihood, the job market for me, individually, would not have been much healthier under Gore. The tech bubble would have burst either way, so my dad would have still been out of a job, though probably would have found something else. I do think as a whole country, a greater number of people are worse off because of Bush's policies. I just happen to be sheltered enough to really feel the pain. Things that this country needs, such as single payer health care for at least basic health needs, were not taken away, they just were not advanced.

So, given all this I can recognize that Bush has made the country as bad as it has been during my life, and he has promised more of the same, what if he is re-elected? I ask myself this question often, though I remain confident that Kerry will pull it out and turn this country around, even if he will not be able to makes sizable improvements due to problems Bush will have saddled on him. Certainly, one consideration is moving to another country that is better than the US currently. Yet, when it comes down to it, I?m a fighter and a patriot, even if I will not fight for my country in the military in a war I do not agree with. Republicans may accuse liberals of cowardice in doing this.

However, by not taking the easy way out, giving up my voice as an American citizen to move somewhere better, by standing my ground and criticizing the government until it makes America that somewhere better; by doing these things, I am being as much a fighter and patriot in defense of my country as those who serve in our military. Not all battles for freedom involve guns. My battle shall be fought with words. It is a battle that I cannot and shall not surrender or give up, because I am right to fight it.

There are two paths in life; there is the easy one, which is wrong, and the hard one, which is right. Courage is taking the right one despite the difficulties. I choose that path.

-The Ideal World-
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« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2004, 12:10:29 am »

Well said Bondo! what a post m8. Since its over 4 years since i live in the states, i didnt poll. But i can say one thing. i felt much safer with Clinton than i did with Bush, and for Bush jr...well i think alot of americans rights are being stepped all over in the name of "national security". people are becoming passive and almost too lazy to change anything, and the few that are heard and wish to be heard, feel the same as you - "traitors". what is that in the land of the free??? as you say, America is supposed to be the shining example of democracy, human rights and tollerance. that's in the past now, cause i see none of it in the direction of the politics atm. Too many excuses are being made in the name of terror as it was in the name of communism in the past. News is being "controlled or atleast attemted to be controlled, newspapers online that have negative Bush artikles are screened and blocked due to its direction and opinion. movie scripts where stopped and productions where pressured by goverment after 9/11. anti american or negative coorporate views have been placed under lids. The few that dare to speak their minds openly are bashed as unamerican. U are not unamerican, you have balls and as much patriotism as any man handling a gun. You are still young and can make a difference, go do it and voice your opinions as much as you dare. all oposition is good, its what makes change in the world, its what will direct the western world from its coorporate ways to more humane ways and its oposition that makes changes the ways of politics. great post m8, thanx for writing it!

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« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2004, 12:52:00 am »

I'm a hell of alot better off.. 4 yrs ago i was barly making enough money to get by.. and i still had an ole 8600 powermac as my main computer.

Now I mke more then enough $, i have 4 computers, moving to a new house (well new to me), I have a new car. so yes.. I am better off then i was 4 yrs ago.
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« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2004, 04:13:58 am »

Well, you all know my opinion on this....so I'm not going to go into how I'm making 10 times more per year, living in a nice house vs an apartment, owning 3 vehicles worth over $100,000 vs 1 car worth about $12,000, have a G5 vs a G3 iMac, and can give over $20,000 a year to charity vs about $1,500-$2,500 a year.

w00t!

Go Bush!
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« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2004, 09:29:09 pm »

I don't see how Bush has anything to do with having better jobs. As you get older, you tend to get better employment opportunities. Unless you're a loser, that is.
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« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2004, 09:40:22 pm »

well i make 2 millions $ a year, give 200 000 a year to charity, get a free bj for each deposit i do at my bank, offered a porsche 911 to the mexican dude who takes care of the yard in front of my castle, invited Arnold for dinner twice this year already, but still, i hate what Bush did to that country, coz i'm sure i could have made more .
« Last Edit: September 27, 2004, 09:41:02 pm by bobby » Logged

OMG another 4 years !!!
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« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2004, 09:58:49 pm »

I guess the point being like every other goddamn political nonsense convo in here is: vote for what is best for you.  You are never going to convince someone else about how bad or good a person is if you never had a bad experience with that said person.

If my life has been going well under bush, chances are, I will vote for his ass.  If my life has been tears and pain with him, I will vote for someone else.  I guess now it has to be seen how many bridges bush has burned to see if he gets reelected.  Trying to point out the flaws of either candidate will do little for anyone here, besides, almost every goddamn post is highly objectional and partisan.

It is mighty interesting to see how the world community is viewing this though. I would say it is pretty obvious a majority hates bush, but domestically he is still around 50%.  Looks like we don't see eye to eye, but what they don't consider is that we must evaluate domestic policiy as well as foreign, I guess this is the factor that is keeping it even.  Americans must be pretty leary of a democratic domestic policy.

This is just a statement of observation, as some well know, I am displeased with both parties.
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*DAMN Bondo
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« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2004, 05:29:48 am »

I don't see how Bush has anything to do with having better jobs. As you get older, you tend to get better employment opportunities. Unless you're a loser, that is.

That is a bit ignorant really. It is true you tend to get more money with time, but that doesn't mean you get more job opportunities.

My dad moved up with time and was VP of marketing...for a tech company. Come the tech bubble burst he is downsized and it is very hard for a 55 year old executive to find work in a more consolodated post-burst market. Doesn't make him a loser, just hard luck. For what it is worth, my dad is voting Bush even though he lost his job and has been unable to find another during Bush's administration.
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« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2004, 06:25:55 am »

Bondo, do you talk politics with your dad ? Why is he voting for Bush ? Apparently, you're not for Bush, so i was wondering where you got your ideas ?
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« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2004, 06:53:25 am »

Well, you all know my opinion on this....so I'm not going to go into how I'm making 10 times more per year, living in a nice house vs an apartment, owning 3 vehicles worth over $100,000 vs 1 car worth about $12,000, have a G5 vs a G3 iMac, and can give over $20,000 a year to charity vs about $1,500-$2,500 a year.

w00t!

Go Bush!
[/size]

Thats because bush gave out tax cuts for the upper class, and upper middle class. so he could sucessfully widen the social class gap, and make the rich richer. so guess hes good at what hes doing, scaming the american people.
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*DAMN Bondo
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« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2004, 05:06:45 pm »

Bondo, do you talk politics with your dad ? Why is he voting for Bush ? Apparently, you're not for Bush, so i was wondering where you got your ideas ?

Talk might be a polite way to put it, I tend to argue politics with my dad at increasing volume levels until I get disgusted by his ignorant and illogical points and leave...or my mom gets upset with us arguing and tells us to stop. I more often discuss politics with my friend who is also a Republican, but can actually defend arguments occasionally.

I don't think I so much "got my ideas" from someone, I have just studied and observed the world and come to my own conclusions. I think my lack of taking ideas from others generally is why I have a lot of out there policy ideas, a lot of concepts that I've never seen or heard stated by anyone else. It is why I call myself a radical moderate. My ideas are fairly centrist, but they are nonstandard. For what it is worth I don't think Bush is very "conservative" either, he is like the opposite version of a radical moderate from me...i.e. the bad version and I'm the nearly perfect version  Grin

If you want to point to something though to explain my general ideologic leanings, my mom is a Democrat and I'm 50% Norwegian (bigtime social democrat country) and 25% French (the scourge of the right...my dad has renounced his French heritage, though apparently because they drove my ancestors out of the country for not being Catholic so maybe he has better reason than just not liking their current actions.)
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