Moderators?

[AK_Kilzo]

Hello all, this is Kilzo;)

I would like to apply for the job as new BL moderator, Im sure just about everyone would agree that I am the right man for the job, I am fair, unbiased and truthful. Please consider this and show your support.

Thank you, Kilzo

[Brain]

never give power to those who ask
    - some famous dead guy

[Grifter]

never give power to those who ask
? ? - some famous dead guy

Didn't I just steal that theory in a previous thread =P.

To be honest, I think Mauti should go back to his gut on this.  When he first asked the old moderators here (Ace, Wrath, Ultimo, Assassin, Me) to be moderators back then, (no offense to Loud or the other even more senior moderators... who this applys to as well)... he picked us based upon his feelings about how we handled ourselves in the forums.  As a result there were no problems between moderators.  The problems didn't start until he started allowing guys that wanted to be moderators a chance at it (Rom... Zak... Nixon...).  Even with Bondo he sent us a mail and asked our opinion.  

As for now, Three moderators (two regular plus Bondo) should be more then enough for the Battle League.  If Mauti thinks another is necessary... then Mauti should look at the people here and how they've acted and then ask someone.

BTW, this all assumes that Nixon is going to be kicked... which I do not think should be assumed yet.  So far we haven't heard from Ultimo, Assassin, Mauti or much from Nixon...  so let's not jump the gun here.  

[Bondo]

First off, no, I don't think we really need another BL admin, the reason I joined wasn't because of workload but because of the problems that had been occuring (and unfortuantely continued thanks to Nixon).

Anyway, I don't think it is quite fair to compare me with the others that asked to be moderator, if I was active in the forums and the BL at the beginning I probably would have been an admin from the start but I didn't get on until last August so things had already started.

[Grifter]

That's why you weren't included in the same breath with them.  

On the good side, you have been active and contributing to the forums.

On the bad side, there has been friction that wasn't present before.

But no, not like with Rom and the others....  

However, I will say this... If Nixon banned AK from the BL without talking to anyone about it, that (to me) is exactly the same as when you banned them from the forums instead of a suspensioin without talking to anyone about it.  You stepped over a line and things are now all good and setteled down about it, but it is really the same thing.  If you thought that was within your power at that time, why wouldn't Nixon think it was within his power?  

I'm not trying to harp on you, I'm just trying to put a little perspective on it.  Now maybe you can understand my (and the other moderators) reactions to it.  Only difference is that I wasn't calling for you to be removed.

And No, I don't think what you have done is nearly as bad as what has gone before....  The main problem with Rom and Zak seemed to be using the delete button too often, especially when it was critisim against them (Rom deleted the first threads about CIA cheating, wanting to hide it.... his was the worst offense and combined with everything else, he really deserved it.  Zak was more just a bad mix with the other moderators).  

So, in this case like most, I'll wait until the full story is in since I don't have an emotional reaction to it =P

[Bondo]

Thankfully I've got the thick skin to take criticism.

I think it is wrong to compare what I did to what Nixon did, he took an action that specifically needs approval and did it by himself, I did an action that I feel was fully within my power (reducing a punishment I was giving).  The difference is night and day.  While you may not agree with what the end punishment, the way I went about changing it is in no way abuse of power.

[Ace]

Bondo, that was not within your power. You cannot straight up ban an entire clan from the forums and all discussion regarding them without checking with us first. I don't know what the BL admins said about making a punishment for the BL, but any policy like that for the General Gossip needs you to check with us first, which you did not.

[Grifter]

Honestly Bondo, to me it's like night and dusk...  How do we know that Nixon didn't think it was in his rights to do the it on his own?  To Ace, Wrath and me, it was that clear that you should have seen it.... why do you presume that Nixon knows better if you didn't?  

I mean, banning someone from talking in the forums is worse then just kicking them out of the BL... even Rom was still free to post here.

But I degress... that's an old issue... the point about Nixon is that it should be brought up to Mauti for him to get involved in, just like any other case involving a Moderator that we can't settle ourselves.

[BTs_Mysterio]

Nixons abuse of power, gives BL a bad image. Or atleast it does to the Noobs. Clean up the trash?

[†FiRE Infection]

Do you think you could get back on track about who the moderators would be.  Mistakes are made and sometimes you have to take a chance with new people.  What do the current league admins think of the task on updating a new ladder with thier current jobs?  If they are up to it it could be possible and if they are not we need more.

[Bondo]

Updating the ladder takes about an hour every week, it is in no way overwhelming, the reason you see the CBs hanging around is that we leave them in the drop box for 48 hours to see if there are any complaints.

Grifter, I didn't so much ban AK from the forums as they said they wouldn't post.  It isn't as much of a decision I made as you think, I just allowed them to use that as their punishment because I thought it would properly cut down on problems, but then you said no and gave them back the right and problems have popped up.

[Ace]

Bondo, you proceeded to lock every thread mentioning AK. I know this because I had to waste my time unlocking them. You also stated straight up in your post that they were not allowed to post anymore. That sounds like a ban to me.

As for the BL, does this sound familiar to anyone. We get a new admin. The BL that had been running well under Ult and Asssassin starts becoming a problem. People bitch and the admin is removed. Why not just leave Ult and Assassin as the only two admins? I don't follow the BL too much, but I have never heard them complain. They obviously do a very good job, so what's the big deal if it's only two of them?

[Grifter]

Grifter, I didn't so much ban AK from the forums as they said they wouldn't post. ?It isn't as much of a decision I made as you think, I just allowed them to use that as their punishment because I thought it would properly cut down on problems, but then you said no and gave them back the right and problems have popped up.

Two corrections and an opinion there my friend...

Correction One:
WE said no, not me.  The other three moderators all chimed in against it.  I was just the most vocal, but can't take all the credit.

Correction Two:
You banned AK as a topic.... not just the members.  You didn't make it sound like a mutual thing at all either.... you stated it was their punishment.

Opinion:
The AK problem sprung up in the Battle League again, just like last time, not in General Gossip.... on a whole, AK bashing is down, due mostly to the efforts of a couple AK's and Rapid keeping a low profile.  Now, do you really expect AK to not be an issue??  You compared them to KoS or DisneY... but you failed to mention that the only complaints about those clans also came from... hmmm... AK?  People kept wondering who was in DisneY.. but again, that doesn't matter and isn't a complaint (nor against any rules, even if I think it was all stupid).  

Ignoring a problem never made it go away, haven't you learned that?  Real problems always show back up.

Seriously Bondo, you have all three of us saying we think it was wrong... are you still arguing that you were right?  It's not like Ace, Wrath or myself are newbies around here.  And you also have me telling you honestly that I see it very much as the same thing... Ace seems to feel the same way... I think you should consider that as you cast judgements on Nixon without even hearing from him here.  Getting angry or upset is one thing, I did with you... but I never thought you should be kicked as a moderator.  So I'm asking you to be a moderator now, and figure out what's going on.... like I said before, if there was a zero tolerance policy that Nixon knew about... maybe this is all a misunderstanding, and Nixon did go about things wrong, but maybe not as wrong as you think..... maybe.

Why not talk to him before calling him out to be removed?  I'm looking to see some sort of justice served.... that's all.

Mystero.... how about learning the truth as to what is trash before calling it such, eh?

[Bondo]

I'm not saying that my AK topic ban was necesarily right, even if it may have been helpful, I do think not having AK post was right as it was their choice.  KoS was also complained about by zak for dodging IIRC.  Anyway, we just have slightly different views on where we draw the line as moderators and that will cause slight problems forever likely but that is somewhat minor as we both think it is the best for the forum.

[Ace]

Bondo, it's not a minor problem. While we may have different views on where to draw the line, wrath, GRIFT, and I almost unilaterally agree on what is acceptable behavior to do on your own because WE DISCUSS IT.

As for AK, if they chose not to post, you didn't need to make a declaration that they were banned. If they felt like not posting, they would not post and that would be the end of it.

[Grifter]

Anyway, we just have slightly different views on where we draw the line as moderators and that will cause slight problems forever likely but that is somewhat minor as we both think it is the best for the forum.

I'm with you there.. and I'd be arguing with anyone, moderator or not, about judging Nixon so quickly.  I meant to point out that just ever so recently, we had this same sort of issue creep up amongst ourselves... and there are two sides to every story (a lesson learned).  It wasn't to open a wound, but to make a point about judging quickly and harshly... that is all.

[+-KoS-+ Gorf]

Heh, i see some of you guys are getting close to 1000 posts
what happens when u get to 1000?  i think it should add Vet. or Veteran to your name  

and now getting to the topic at hand:  Hehe. i realized this morning, that this is all pointless for me.  I use GR to have a good time and play RS, and lately i have been wasting time in these forums and i miss the real stuff.  So from now on, i am just gonna be more laid back, forget about the forums, and have a good time playing RS.  because in case some people have forgotten, that is what this place was founded for to begin with.

                              ~Gorf out.

[Bondo]

And Gorf, we are still fighting to restore it to that way.  Btw, about 1000 posts, I suppose Mauti knows if it does or doesn't not do anything, but it is just a matter of time before I find out.