Baseball Playoffs

[Jeb]

While you queers are argueing about baseball and spewing your nonsense i'll be drinking a hieneken, eating a steak, smoking a cuban, and watching the world series (at my house on a 42inch flat panel screen)
and yes, i have cuban cigars.

[Bondo]

What's wrong Ace...couldn't just say I disagree?  No, I guess not, you had to insult me.  You want to know why Cal Ripken Jr. and Tony Gywnn are better players.  Because in addition to being solid offensively and defensively (like Bonds) they are also leaders.  They were the guys the clubhouse looked to.  That isn't true of Bonds.  He isn't particularly liked or admired by teamates other than that he helps them win, but he isn't going to be helping them out of their struggles.  Sorry that you don't view the same things as important...and that you are biased by liking the Giants so much, but your quick use of insults just shows how desperate you are to argue.

[Jeb]

What did Carl Ripken Jr lead the oreals to? Shit, Ozzi Smith or edgar martinez are  much better leaders than any of those people on your list bondo.

[Ace]

What's wrong Ace...couldn't just say I disagree?  No, I guess not, you had to insult me.  You want to know why Cal Ripken Jr. and Tony Gywnn are better players.  Because in addition to being solid offensively and defensively (like Bonds) they are also leaders.  They were the guys the clubhouse looked to.  That isn't true of Bonds.  He isn't particularly liked or admired by teamates other than that he helps them win, but he isn't going to be helping them out of their struggles.  Sorry that you don't view the same things as important...and that you are biased by liking the Giants so much, but your quick use of insults just shows how desperate you are to argue.

Bondo, Barry may not be liked by all of his teammates, but he is sure as hell admired for all his abilities. Is he some dynamic clubhouse leader? No. If this were hockey that would be more important, but not in baseball. Even though it is a team game, baseball is very much an individual sport. You go to bat alone, you make plays in the field alone (for the most part), etc. Besides, that's not his job. That's what the Giants have Dusty for. Liking Barry has nothing to do with being biased towards the Giants; he is simply that damn good. Go watch Baseball Tonight sometime. Go read some ESPN.com articles. They all know Barry is one of the greatest, and if ESPN isn't a source for credible sports opinions I don't know what is. Finally, I can't just say I disagree when you are blatantly wrong. If you are a moron, I'm going to call you a moron.

[Bondo]

Good point Jeb with Ozzie Smith...Kirby Puckett as well had he not had his career shortened by injury.

Ace, I'm sure there are some people like you, including ESPN people who say he is the greatest, but there are also ESPN people who say others are the greatest...what is your fucking point.  You pompous attitude of your right and anyone who disagrees on something that is completely subjective is a moron makes you the moron Ace.  Now fucking grow up already, I thought you were in college...oh wait, most college aged students are like you, sucks to be me and mature beyond my years.

[Ace]

Now fucking grow up already, I thought you were in college...oh wait, most college aged students are like you, sucks to be me and mature beyond my years.

And I'm the pompous, immature one?

Ace, I'm sure there are some people like you, including ESPN people who say he is the greatest, but there are also ESPN people who say others are the greatest...what is your fucking point.  You pompous attitude of your right and anyone who disagrees on something that is completely subjective is a moron makes you the moron Ace.

Bondo, it's only subjective to a degree. I don't think he is the greatest ever, but he certainly is one of the greatest. That's undeniable. When Barry has won more MVPs than anyone else, that alone is a damn good quantitative fact to support my argument. He also has the 4th most home runs ever. Nothing subjective about that. He has the records for most intentional walks and walks in a season. That's about the only objective way to judge how feared/respected a hitter is and he wins hands down. 490 odd steals, 8 Gold Gloves. More and more objective analysis. You are the one who tried to bring up intangibles, probably the most subjective trait of a player one can talk about. Don't be buttsore because I have facts to back up my claims and you simply chose to ignore them. Moron.

[Bondo]

The subjective part is in how much you consider numbers Ace, not in the rankings.  So no matter how many numbers you list, you can't prove that someone is a superior player...maybe a superior home run hitter but not a superior player.

[PsYcO aSsAsSiN]

As much as I hate Bonds, and as much as I think he is a prick (example: Bonds would not sign a team ball when he was with the Pirates for a charity auction, so the charity had to buy his autograph from QVC and get the rest of the team to sign the ball) he is one of the best, if not the best, position player of this generation.

What Barry Bonds lacks in charisma and leadership, he makes up with his individual numbers. Now while I think that Ripken, Gwynn, Puckett, and others are great ball players, none of them have reached the platform that Barry shares with other greats such as Ted Williams, Babe Ruth, Joe DiMaggio, Willie Mays et al.

Here are the reason why they don't reach the levels of Barry Bonds:

Tony Gwynn: Perennial winner of the Silver Slugger award and winner of numerous batting titles. Gwynn himself said on a national telecast of a game between the Giants and the Dodgers that Bonds is the best player of this generation. He said Barry in his older age has improved his plate discipline, being more selective, and when he gets something to hit, he hits it (Bonds is the oldest player to ever win his first batting title [37])

Kirby Puckett: Debate raged whether he should even make the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. His career was too short for him to even be mentioned as an all time great, much less than stacking up to Bonds.

Ripken: Sorry, Cal Ripken Jr. is basically nothing without his Ironman streak that he took from Lou Gehrig in 1994. Rickey Henderson has better career stats then Cal.

Tonight's game: Angels defeat Twins behind the ass whooping the Angels hitters put on Joe Mays.

[Ace]

I just got back from a lab so I don't know if the game has started yet, but I'll make my series prediction anyways. This is a real tough one. Two underdogs going at each other is hell to pick. In the end, for a reason I don't really know why, I'm picking the Angels in 7. No wait, I'm picking the Twins in 7. Fuck this is so close! Screw it, Angels in 7 cuz of Salmon and Eckstein. Don't ask me why.

[(SiX)Ben]

I'm going with a total ownage by the Angels... They're gonna suprise us all... Angels in 5!

Ben

P.S. Giants in 6

[PsYcO aSsAsSiN]

I already said the Angels were going to the World Series, but the NL poses a different problem. If the Cardinals had Scott Rolen, the Cardinals go the World Series without a doubt. But without Rolen, the Cardinals are significantly weaker in the lineup and on the field. This goes to 7 games with the Cardinals pulling it out. St. Louis has the emotional advantage in the series, and I think that is the determining factor.

[(SiX)Ben]

I think you just like to root against the Giant's because you're extreme hate for them... You underestimate them every time....

P.S. Giants in 6!

Ben

[Ace]

I'm saying Giants in 5. We move to the World Series with a win at home from Woody in game 5.

[(SiX)Ben]

Dude, I just had to comment on that Giants/Cardinal's game..

First, I wanted to say everyone who said the Cards 3rd basemen being out would "hurt them so bad" was totally off. Cairo, his replacement, was awesome tonight... I believe he was on base more then anyone else on his team... In my opinion, he did a better job at 3rd and on the offence then any other cardinal, in or out!

Now, that game was an awesome game... Main point of excitement... hell it brought the crowd into a 5-1 game... the words exchanged between both teams on the field... Last time the Giants and Cardinals met in the playoffs, a fight broke out in which 2 cardinals jumped will clark... This fight cleared off both bench's for both teams... This year Lofton was warned before he went up to the plate that something was awry... And sure enough, when he got up there... there was a pitch to ask him to back off the plate (although it was exagerated)... Lofton turned and said something to the pitcher... It should have ended there! But their catcher stepped in and said something degrading to Lofton... This brought both benches onto the field... And the managers who recently said they respected eachother just yesterday, were at eachothers throats... (Dusty pushed off the guy after screaming at him, then put his hands up, looking all innocent when the guy tried to retaliate)... Granted, nothing happenned except a tense moment.. Still, it was, in my opinion, what broguth the crowd into the game... In that sence, it could be called a game changer. (Remember, later that inning they hit in their homeruns)

Hehehe, yah... I concentrated on the fight... That was really the only thing worth mention besides the fact BARRY BONDS DID NOT CHOKE! (yes... addressed to all you anti-Barry Bond's people!) Awesome game for Lofton, Santiago, (wow... nice on knees off balance throw to second for the tag) and Bonds... For the opposing team their main men were Cairo Emerso and Pelijosa or however you spell that...

Ben

[Bondo]

Lofton is a punk, I mean the pitch was a little in and a little up but hardly a throw at the head or anything.  If pitchers can't throw at all to brush a batter back than baseball has just gone soft.  Lofton should have just stepped back in...no words to the pitcher needed.  He is a vet, he should understand the game by now.

[(SiX)Ben]

And now the rest of the story

Some Giant... Saen Dunston, was looking at the Cardinal bench when Lofton hit his homerun... Supposedly the manager pointed at Lofton and said something to the pitcher after that homerun, so Dunston told him to watch out as the pitcher was gonna try and hit him... So Lofton went up there and thought that was the pitchers attempt... He yelled something at the pitcher, but it was going to end there... Then the catcher stood up and got in front of Lofton saying something (I still don't know what)... In Lofton's mind the pitcher was going to try and hit him, so he was going to stop it there...

Ben

[Bondo]

I don't see how that changes things.  Ever think that he told the pitcher to brush him back and not to hit him?  It is just as likely...and thus Lofton shouldn't assume and thus react.

[Ace]

I don't see how that changes things.  Ever think that he told the pitcher to brush him back and not to hit him?  It is just as likely...and thus Lofton shouldn't assume and thus react.

Lofton got brushed back for staring at his home run for a few seconds. It's common for a batter to stare a little when he jacks one, especially in a postseason game where emotions are magnified. Morris had no reason to brush Lofton back, and even if he did have a reason it's unprofessional to brush someone back up near the head. That's one of baseball's unwritten rules. If you are going to plunk someone for a reason, you do it on the thigh or as close to there as possible. Lofton had every reason to yell at the pitcher.

Oh yeah Sin, what was that about the Cards? Bwahaha, 1-0 and we got Schmidt on the hill tomorrow night.

[PsYcO aSsAsSiN]

The series isnt over until one team wins 4 games Ace.

As for Ben, you are an idiot, period. Rolen was the best third baseman in all of baseball and you sure as hell bet that the Cardinals miss his bat in the lineup. 31 HR's and 110 RBI, and a Gold Glove are hard to replace...and if you take a look back, the Cardinals started getting hot right after Rolen came from Philly.

This series will go seven games like I said before...

[Ace]

The series isnt over until one team wins 4 games Ace.

As for Ben, you are an idiot, period. Rolen was the best third baseman in all of baseball and you sure as hell bet that the Cardinals miss his bat in the lineup. 31 HR's and 110 RBI, and a Gold Glove are hard to replace...and if you take a look back, the Cardinals started getting hot right after Rolen came from Philly.

This series will go seven games like I said before...

Yeah, I violated rule #1 and started gloating too early, but an NLCS doesn't come along too often in these parts of town so it's not all that surprising that we are enthusiastic.

Sin, Ben makes an excellent point about Rolen. Cairo went 3-4 with 2 runs and 2 RBIs. No one can argue that they missed Rolen's bat if Cairo continues to put up numbers like this. I don't remember any plays in the field that Rolen might have gotten instead of Cairo, and Cairo made no errors, so the way I see it defensively he has been his equal. However, this is only one game and I pray Cairo doesn't keep hitting us like that. If he does, Rolen being out didn't mean much, and if he doesn't I'll just be happy we shut him down.