So what can we do?

[Saberian 3000]

exactly Mysteriio.  Sometimes I think lately that you are a different person because your responses are much more precise and realistic lately. GG.  Anyway, yes that is exactly the reason why they should be visible to the public.  I dont think that anyone but admins should be able to reply to them but yes, we should at least be able to see them to know what is going on.  That way we can keep informed on what is currently going on within the BL.  That has been our main problem with the BL the last 2 seasons.  Because we dont know what is going on, we arent able to understand the decisions that are being made.  At least this way we would have a better understanding of what is going on if there is an issue with the BL at that time.  Plus if someone opens a post that is flaming about the issue you could always lock that topic.  And since you guys do that anyway, nothing would really change there.  Just a little more locking.  And if it is to the point of being offensive to anyone you could always remove it and explain why, or again, lock it, that way no one can respond to the issue.  

the concern I have is for the welfare of the participants of the league because if we are kept up on the latest issues, we can at least have some idea of what the issues are and then at that time present them to their local admin to comment.  And locking them so we cant reply but admins can would keep the flaming to a minimum.  I know this will make a little more work for the admins but to be honest, they are the admins, and when they signed up for this job they basically took the responsability on their hands to control thr forums and issues for the good of the public.  This should be no different except that they are taking a little more responsability in watching the forums.  I dont think by keeping us informed that it would make mass hysteria.  I think by controlling the forums from flaming on these issues and locking peoples posts that they make is really the best thing that you guys can do.  At least people's words can be seen if that is the case and no one can reply on them.  

:MoD:Saberian

:MoD:Saberian

[Typhy]

This is for Saber and anyone else promoting the admin section becoming public.

The biggest advantage of having the admins section public would be that admins would be forced to justify their voting, where as they might feel less pressure to do so if only their fellow admins could view the thread.

However, this comes with some major disadvantages. I'll use c| and BTs as examples.

c| and BTs have an issue in a CB. I believe that c| has absolutely no case, and was completly at fault. However, I've got some good friends in c|, and I would love to vote against BTs in public, as a little taste of revenge.

If the debate and vote is public, I would quite possibly go in favor of c|, dispite the fact that I think they're wrong. I wouldn't want to go against my friends publically, and I'd love to piss some of the BTs guys off.

However, if the debate and the vote are in the admins section, I would unquestionably vote for BTs, on the basis of the fact that they're right.

( This isn't an attempt at a flame. I used BTs as an example because we're pretty open with our dislike for one another, and I thought it'd make a realistic example. )

I think having votes in public places more pressure on an admin to vote for what's popular, as oposed to what's right.

[Toxic::Joka]

I think this whole debate about not making the admin section public is patronising.

I really dont get this "it would increase the flaming" argument. What the hell do you discuss there that would increase flaming?

Typhy, I really didn't get your point either.. . you would vote aggainst your friends privately but not publicly..  

Make it public, and make *DAMN democratic

Enough of this grey area shit.

[Typhy]

Joka, it'd be really nice if things were that simple. Hell, if things were that easy, we wouldn't even need Battle League admins, there simply wouldn't be problems. But guess what? They're not.

It's like all those shitty classes you have to take in middle school that talk about "Peer Pressure". You'll do things around your friends that you don't believe in, or that you wouldn't without them around.

You come out, you make your case, then the jury heads off to make the decision, they don't debate it and vote on it with you sitting there infront of them.

Tell me, why do you want to be able to see the admin discussions? What problems in the Battle League do you think this can solve?

I've supported my opinion. Time for you to support yours with a bit more than "make *DAMN democratic".

I'm not close minded about this, but I have to hear some reasons.  

[Brutha]

The main reason for not having an open Admin section in my eyes is that:

The admins are here to ensure that the league runs smoothly and is fun for the rest of us. They dont get paid, they work out of ideology. They are admins from clans out there, and therefore run the risk of being accused of being biased. Yes, I agree that what has been done earlier this season whith the chairman and other admins giving us explanations of why the decision was made, is a good thing. But that we should sit there and look into every matter is not right. To ensure the uninfluenced voting from the admins I think we should not participate. But, to remove our influence as a comunity completely is wrong. Perhaps on major issues we should be allowed to discuss the issue at hand first. Have an open forum where we can debate on the proposed rules for example.

But the admins need to get of their high horse. At occasions I have asked some questions concerning decisions and all the answers i got was "it will be explained later". That is not good enough. You should give more than that. This is one of the things i thing the community is getting somewhat...pissed about. So, work with us....not against us as it sometimes feels like.

[Aramarth]

Horda and Gambit are (or in the near future will be) no longer admins. The full list for next season, excluding the few we plan to add, is quite short: Civic, Flies, myself, and I suppose King. He is about as active as Horda and Gambit, but I never hear anyone whining about him.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Horda and Gambit are (or in the near future will be) no longer admins. The full list for next season, excluding the few we plan to add, is quite short: Civic, Flies, myself, and I suppose King. He is about as active as Horda and Gambit, but I never hear anyone whining about him.

Yikes....how about Civic, Flies, Aramarth, King of Pop, New Admins?

Ara is the only one on the list worth keeping.

[Aramarth]

 
Doesn't that make me... hmmm... a little too influential?

I don't always agree with Civic and Flies, but I am not sure that I would say they are useless.

[BTs_Mysterio]

MYSTERIO! I mean new admins should be selected in due time. Wait a tick I have another job offer.

[c| King.of.Pop]

Im a noob admin, yes.  And this season being my first I have not been able to be as active as I would like.  But my posts, opinions and votes are always objective and I dont pick fights.  I feel I provide good input when needed and I dont avoid voting on or discussing any issue which needs to be resolved.  I'm also available to anyone on Gameranger whenever I'm on (which is quite often) that has questions be it an average joe or clan member or admin.  I also actually vote on things and present opinions that I feel are for the better of the community and not just my clan.  Is there a problem GhostSniper?

King

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Is there a problem GhostSniper?

No, not at all.  I did that just to make Aramarth feel better after we beat up on him for 3 days.[/size]  

[BTs_Mysterio]

I personally think Mr. King is a great admin. He respects the league in the way necessary. I do also support Flies as a admin.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

I personally think Mr. King is a great admin. He respects the league in the way necessary. I do also support Flies as a admin.

Well, aren't you just the brown-nosing, ass-kissing forum bitch?!  lol

[BTs_Mysterio]

GS, honestly, those are the only 2 I can say I like. Well at least after Ara cause that misunderstanding and didn't admit his mistake until it was way too late to be worth it. And good ol' Civic....no... I mean....

[BTs_hooks]

i have an idea how about we decide who gets the boot out of the admin spot and you guys ( BL staff ) pick the replacements.