Acri's discovery of the glitches in Dedust

[Saberian 3000]

Well,  this isnt gonna make people happy but we (Aramarth, Wickedson, Nomad, Carbon, Shade, Macaddict, and myself) just tried what Acri's discussed in the last topic and we have concluded that he is absolutely correct.  This Dedust map should not be played.  Cause of the issue with the bad map making we have tested all of the other 1.5 maps and to our suprise we have found some serious glitches on almost all of them making them now unplayable.  The list includes:

DeDust (of course)
Prison (night)
Reservoir
Bunker Park

We havent tested out all of the 2.0 maps but I can say this much, the only one that we tested with any success is Chalet.  As far as the 1.5 maps they should all be taken off and re-evaluated cause of the glitches that we have found.  In my opinion, and I can speak for everyone in the game that these maps are NOT playable by any means of the word.  All of them have fatal glitches to where someone could easily cheat or glitch and have a perfect view of either a crucial spot of the game or of the whole map in itself.  Therefore I do believe that now the whole DAMN BL mappacks should be taken out for further evaluation because of the serious glitching issue.  If anyone would like to see SS's of the maps let me know and of course I will send them to ya.

My issue is how many people knew about these serious glitches beforehand?  Hmm, well anyway ckeck it for ureself


:MoD:Saberian

[Blitz]

What's really funny about this is I never liked teh *DAMN BL MapPack, and I hope both versions 1.5 and 2.0 be taken down, and not released until they are perfect in everyway in which glitching is not present.

Blitz

[Supernatural Pie]

It's absolutely hilarious every time i think about it.


You could glitch at any wall of any map in rogue spear... and yet, no map was ever deemed unplayable because of cheating, because no one ever cheated.


Pity.

[BFG]

Well now just isnt' then snipe.. and GhR isn't RS, and kids will be kids and of course who's to say they didn't cheat...?

what im slightly confused about is if people knew about these issues before now... Why didn't they say!

[th.Sentinel]

I knew from the start when the first version of the Damn maps came out, that there were lots of glitches. But I never thought they could be a threat as long as no one would use them during a cb. I know most of the glitches on those maps, and I think if I play against a clan who uses those glitches I could ask for a replay and see if its true what I thought. There for I didn't mention it, and most of the ppl who knew these glitches prolly thought the same way.

I find it a bit surprising a lot of you guys never knew about these glitches on de dust. When I'm hosting I try to avoid playing de dust, because I know some ppl use it to just piss you off on your own host. They think its kinda fun shootin ppl when they can't be seen and shot on.

And on bunker park I once fell trough a wall by accident, and suddenly I was inside the bunker. I'm happy I noticed it during a normal game, and not during a cb. I don't like being called a cheater or glitcher.

Come to think of it, I think the glitches were mentioned before, but no one responded to it a while back. For me the most crucial glitching maps shouldn't be played during a cb. But don't forget the normal Ghr maps also have some of these glitches...

[BTs_eight]

If we all know the glitches then we don't do them.
One thing GhR has over RS is that if someone glitched in RS its more of a he said she said... With GhR if we know the glitches and avoid them we'll be ok... but if someone does glitch, then we can call for replays...

Some of the new maps (for those guys who dont play GhR) have a decent amount of glitches that the normal game doesnt have... I dont think we should eliminate them all just take a look at these glitches maybe post them somewhere... with ss so people have a clue as to what your talking about.

[Stripes]

lets keep de dust... it will be easy 2 discover if someone glitches  on the maps.. just ask for replays... godammit... if u take De_Dust.. then u should take ALL Maps... (DMP's) since there is glitches in like everyone, it's just about time and we found em...


***Stripes : wants 2 keep De-Dust As well, i like the map - and it is one of the most played maps, with (embassy)

[BTs_GhostSniper]

None of these maps should be deleted.

Peace.

-GhostSniper Out.

[Saberian 3000]

Well, I am glad that you think that, but the simple fact is that people will use them.  the simple issue is that the rules for BL state that a clan that is caught glitching twice in a cb will be counted as a forfiet.  Well, what about that one time.  Basically it is stating that they are allowed to get away with something like that.  personally I dont think these maps should be allowed.  By allowing these maps you are basiclaly stating that it is ok to glitch once, which in my opinion is a load of shit.  So decide what you will but I wont be a part of using a mappack that has this many glitches already within the map.  Like I said we have found ovewr 10 glitches alone in Dedust.  So for that map and many others I do not feel that for CB gameplay they should be allowed.  

Again, we can change the rule about glitching but by letting people play maps that they are tempted to glitch on is basically stating that it's all right to glitch once during a cb, which again is shit.

as for Eight's statement, if we dont do them, who's to say the other clan wont pick that map.  And to have to agree not to use glitchy maps is kinda bullshit as well cause they shouldnt be there in the first place.  I would like to play a game with the least amount of possible cheats as possible.  This way it takes the possibilities of cheating out of the hands of the individual.  Especially the individual who happens to accidentally lose the cb replays that were requested.   Think about it, fo all fair intensive purposes we should only use maps that are FULLY tested for these things, which again these were not.  And if people already knew about this they should have let us all know instead of keeping it to themselves cause most of us dont like to ask for replays unless we thought they were cheating.  So who's to say these havent been used in cb's already played unbenownsted to the losing team, and they were jsut under the assumption that they played fair in the first place.  By putting these possible windows in the game is not only bullshit, but very un-professional.  So for those who agree that maps with serious glitches in it should be allowed in a cb league.  This will just bring some serious problems for the future of the BL.  


:MoD:Saberian

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Well, I am glad that you think that, but the simple fact is that people will use them.  the simple issue is that the rules for BL state that a clan that is caught glitching twice in a cb will be counted as a forfiet.  Well, what about that one time.  Basically it is stating that they are allowed to get away with something like that.  personally I dont think these maps should be allowed.  By allowing these maps you are basiclaly stating that it is ok to glitch once, which in my opinion is a load of shit.  So decide what you will but I wont be a part of using a mappack that has this many glitches already within the map.  Like I said we have found ovewr 10 glitches alone in Dedust.  So for that map and many others I do not feel that for CB gameplay they should be allowed.  
Again, we can change the rule about glitching but by letting people play maps that they are tempted to glitch on is basically stating that it's all right to glitch once during a cb, which again is shit.
as for Eight's statement, if we dont do them, who's to say the other clan wont pick that map.  And to have to agree not to use glitchy maps is kinda bullshit as well cause they shouldnt be there in the first place.  I would like to play a game with the least amount of possible cheats as possible.  This way it takes the possibilities of cheating out of the hands of the individual.  Especially the individual who happens to accidentally lose the cb replays that were requested.   Think about it, fo all fair intensive purposes we should only use maps that are FULLY tested for these things, which again these were not.  And if people already knew about this they should have let us all know instead of keeping it to themselves cause most of us dont like to ask for replays unless we thought they were cheating.  So who's to say these havent been used in cb's already played unbenownsted to the losing team, and they were jsut under the assumption that they played fair in the first place.  By putting these possible windows in the game is not only bullshit, but very un-professional.  So for those who agree that maps with serious glitches in it should be allowed in a cb league.  This will just bring some serious problems for the future of the BL.  
:MoD:Saberian

Dude, there are glitches like this on a BUNCH of the Ghost Recon maps, old and new alike.  I can show you glitches as bad or worse than the ones you are talking about on several of the old maps....namely Day Castle, Small River, and Red Square.  If you are going to ban a map just because there are glitches on it, then you might as well ban Ghost Recon all together from the ladder, because there are glitches throughout the game!

[Aramarth]

if u take De_Dust.. then u should take ALL Maps...

None of these maps should be deleted.

You boys are missing the point. There aren't nearly the same amount of issues on the other maps. We are not arbitrarily picking these maps, we played them all and found that those listed are error-laden enough that they shouldn't be valid to play at all.

This isn't a "we found this error and we want it gone" issue. It is litterally reflection of every-other-10-seconds someone else is shouting "holy shit" into netfone as they found yet another wall they can run right through. It was sick on dust especially... and I honestly think arguing for that map is the equivalent of defending the common man's right to stab somebody. It just isn't happening.

Ara

P.S. Dust isn't just a buggy map, it is the MOST buggy map known to anyone I know. Banning such a thing is a courtesy.

[BTs_GhostSniper]

P.S. Dust isn't just a buggy map, it is the MOST buggy map known to anyone I know. Banning such a thing is a courtesy.

Look!  We didn't ask for these maps in the first place.  The *DAMN Battle League forced them down our throats without us being able to say a damn thing about it.  Well, that is fine....we learned to battle on these maps so that we could effectively play in CBs on them.  Now you guys want to take maps away that you made us learn against our will to begin with.

Well I say FUCK THAT!  I am sick and tired of the Battle League Running my life!  You say one day you have to play on these extra maps years after you learned the game on the maps that Ghost Recon came with, and now you say "oh just forget about these maps cause we shouldn't have put them in to begin with."

OH FUCKING WELL.  You can't have everything.  These maps are already here, we have already spent hours upon hours learning them.  LET THEM STAY.  I will be royally pissed if you delete maps that you made me learn against my will to begin with.

What a bunch of BS.

-GhostSniper Out.

[BTs_Lee.Harvey]

lol ghost.....

Well i just did some testing on my own on Dust... I checked every possible place and didnt finds anymore glitches then say castle day.. or anyother regular GhR map for that matter.

[Monoman]

Look!  We didn't ask for these maps in the first place.  The *DAMN Battle League forced them down our throats without us being able to say a damn thing about it.  Well, that is fine....we learned to battle on these maps so that we could effectively play in CBs on them.  Now you guys want to take maps away that you made us learn against our will to begin with.

Actually GS the first map pack was discussed with everyone. Everyone was able to post bugs and glitches about the maps. DBL 1 Thread

[BTs_GhostSniper]

Look!  We didn't ask for these maps in the first place.  The *DAMN Battle League forced them down our throats without us being able to say a damn thing about it.  Well, that is fine....we learned to battle on these maps so that we could effectively play in CBs on them.  Now you guys want to take maps away that you made us learn against our will to begin with.

Actually GS the first map pack was discussed with everyone. Everyone was able to post bugs and glitches about the maps. DBL 1 Thread

No, this is not what I'm talking about at all.  I'm not talking about discussing bugs and glitches and spawn points, etc.  I'm talking about the way that we had no choice in being required to use the Mappacks.  The Battle League told us it was a requirement to HAVE these Mappacks, whether we liked it or not.  That is what we had no say in.  And now some of these admins and other people want some of these maps deleted.  Well that is just a bunch of BS.

The MAP PACKS stay with all maps included!

-GhostSniper Out.

[BFG]

 That is what we had no say in.? And now some of these admins and other people want some of these maps deleted.? Well that is just a bunch of BS.

Thats right GS, this is all just to try and piss you off as much as possible. it has nothing to do with the rest of the community, its just to specificly piss of Ghost sniper and any similar BTs guys... come on now for gods sake.

By no means did all the admins know about the map packs etc to my knowledge.. Hell i didn't know a thing about the 2.0map pack until after it had been released... ask mauti, civic or revolt about that.

The map packs were and have been an effort to bring change and variety to the BL. thats a good thing. Everything has problems, things go wrong. its what we call "life".  It would be nice if people would just stop bitching and whining and just help sort the problem out.

[Saberian 3000]

Well, it seems that pissing off Ghost Sniper isnt a hard thing to do lol.  In either event that was not my intention.  If anyone would like to go into a game with me I can point out the numerious glitches.  You guys think that Ghost recon had some bad glitches with the standard maps?  Plz man, dont make me fucking laugh.  Tell ya what GS, we will go into a game tomorrow after I get off of work.  i will show you every fucking glitch in Dedust alone.  Then you find me a massive amount of glitches that is even close to the number from the original maps.  If you can do that then i will revoke my statement.  The simple fact is that you cant even come close man.  Plz, if you arent willing to see the examples we present then STFU and stop whining.  I am just making a statement about the playability of the maps.  Dont get pissed, although I guess it's better to be pissed off then pissed on =)   Take me up on my offer if you dont believe me GS.  Acri was so kind as to point these out, we just went the next step.  Unless you like the glitches.   So I suggest you either show up and look for ureself, or just plainly shut up plz.  Just because we dont agree with your way of thinking dosent mean you should get pissed.  

At first I thought it was a load of shit, just read under Acri's little post and you will see that I did not agree that the map should be taken out.  But I invited Acri to prove it to me which he did with just a few simple SS's.  He was absolutely right and so I started this post cause I had 6 other players go in with me to verify that there was an issue.  From 3 different clans.  When the issue was obviously present then we decided to check the rest of the maps.  We did and therefore agreed that because of these serious cheats these particular maps cannot be played for a Battle League.  Just take me up on my offer and stop getting upset.

this isnt a simple tree glitch, or a oops, I am in the corner of the wall glitch.  This is a omfg I am inbetween the wall glitch and can shoot anyone from any part of the map with my bullets going right thru any wall on the map glitch.  I doubt you will find one like that on a regular GR or DS map.  

As for Lee Harvey, I invite you as well to see the issues at hand.  You dont believe me, see for ureself.  Obviously you didnt look hard enought cause they are as plain as day as you will be forced to open ure eyes and see.

And I am not an admin GS, so dont think of this as some type of ploy. As you can see I play in this same BL as you, or as you did.  In either event check it with me and a few others and see for ureself.

:MoD:Saberian

[BTs_eight]

Ummm... Bfg... chill out homey

GS has a HUGE point...

No one asked for them to be thrown at us mid season... anytime these new maps were THROWN at us.... we had to deal with it... even with constant posts about how we should test the shit out of the maps before we play them... instead i got (some) admins jumping down my throat saying "we did this to piss you off" comment... Now you guys are on the other side of the fence and were now asking for them to stay and we get the same god damn BULLSHIT.

I vote for the maps to stay.. I vote for DBL Map Pack version 2 to also stay...

Maybe next time... before forcing people to play 2 seasons on them and forcing them to change tactics mid season (when all the rules seem to be changed and modified)

How about some proper testing in the future?

From searching on the INet... NO OTHER LEAGUE changes so many rules MID SEASON....

Instead of this disscussion being here about changing shit that already happened how about a thread talking about the NEW RULES that should be introduced before the new season starts?

Sabe post the SS you have.... hey post the replays also...

In any case if any clan caught doing these and other glitches will be caught on the replays so i dont see what the problem is.....

[BFG]

Im confused, but i just get this inpression from some people that its a case of

"Oh well we didn't want the map packs in the first place, now you've found problems with it, haha live with it"

Of course nobody (i don't think) wants to scrap all the new maps - they are fun to play on for heavens sake... it would be a whole lot easier if we could just try and remove the problem... we have so many modders and moddlers can someone not help out in removing the glitch possitions?

Not all the admins enjoy sitting down every evening to watch six or seven replays of glitches... it would be much nicer to resolve any problems and issues with the maps and the glitching issues before they clans even play on them

[Saberian 3000]

Good point BFG,

It blows me away that people bitch about the maps.  But when there is an inherent issue found with them then people just turn their opinion and say deal with it.  As for taking out the maps I dont like the idea of taking them out personally because I do like dedust from when i used the map in Rogue Spear and many of the other maps including prison and whatnot were also fun as well.  But the problem is that the map because of the way it was made by the PC guy that originally made it did not make the map correctly and did not do things to the specs that the map should have been written.  This unfortunatly makes the point of taking out the map over fixing it, which as far as I can tell cant really be fixed, but most likely would have to be rewritten.  Now if we were to leave the maps into the CB ladder then this would create an issue to where more people would worry about the glitch and more issues wouldhave to be dealt with by admins.  As far as I know you guys dont want that, so for you to say leave the maps in, you are basically saying please screw over the players of the league, so we have to have more issues that need to be dealt with and slow down the league progress.  Our objective as players is to make this a better ladder, so we dont have to deal with as many issues during the season.  Granted I did not approve of Mauti's idea of introducing mappakcs in the middle of a season.  But now is not the time to bitch about that by rebutting the idea of taking them out by saying that since they put them in that we should deal with them.  The more important thing is to make sure that these issues are dealt with now, so for next season it is that many less issues that we as a CB league have to deal with.  Again, If you would like to see some glitches come joinn me in a game and take a look for ureself.  Nothing like seeing it first hand.  So think before you speak, since it seems that the speaking is all based off of revenge over anything else.


:MoD:Saberian