*DAMN R6 Forum

Dunno if you guys have read this yet or not. ?I read it in the paper this morning and found it online to show all the damn mac users that populate this forum. ?I don't know if this link will work in the morning so I've copied and pasted the article below.

http://detnews.com/2002/technology/0207/29/d08-548210.htm

Apple upgrades irritate some Macintosh users
CEO Jobs says company aims for greater market share
By Gene Steinberg / Gannett News Service

???Some fans of Apple Computer's Macintosh personal computers and software are grumbling about having to pay more for essential software and services following the recent Macworld Expo in New York City.
???Like other PC makers, Apple Computer is finding it harder to convince faithful Mac users to upgrade to new models. Rather than cut expenses and lay off huge chunks of its staff (only small layoffs have taken place), Apple CEO Steve Jobs said during a two-hour keynote address that the company will continue to innovate with new products and technologies, hoping to position itself for a greater market share when the slump is over.
???However, in the interim, Apple might be trying to make up for lost hardware sales with new revenue from a costly upgrade to the new version of its Mac OS X operating system software and annual fees to use Apple's online e-mail and Web hosting service, which had been free. Such moves weren't well received by some of the Macintosh faithful.
???"If Apple wants us to buy new computers, they better stop charging us every time we turn around," said Rose Ferri, a Mac enthusiast via e-mail.
???While Mac owners debate Apple's pricing strategy for upgrades and online services, the company is moving ahead with the release of some distinctively styled and technologically sophisticated products.
???
Jaguar has bite
???At the top of the list was the rollout of Jaguar, the code-name for the 10.2 version of Apple's Unix-based operating system, Mac OS X. Boasting more than 150 new features, the upgrade will go on sale on August 24 for $129.
???Apple isn't providing discounts -- which are common when upgrading software from previous versions -- for Mac owners who bought OS X 10.0 for $129 when it was introduced in March 2001. Only customers who buy a new Mac between now and Jaguar's release will get a free upgrade.
???Among Jaguar's flashiest improvements is a new version of Apple's Mail application, sporting an enhanced junk mail filter employing what Apple calls "adaptive latent semantic analysis" to separate the mail you want to read from the mail you want to trash.
???iChat is also new for Jaguar. It's an application that works with AOL's instant messaging system. With typical Apple flamboyance, iChat puts chat text in cartoon-like thought bubbles, and lets users identify themselves with either icons or photos.
???The updated version of Apple's Internet search application, Sherlock 3, will display such information as phone numbers, stock quotes and movie schedules in a single window, so you're not forced to switch to a Web browser to get the information.

Digital hub gains new spokes
???Apple's vision of the personal computer as the hub of your digital lifestyle gained two more components at the Expo. In addition to supporting such devices as music players and camcorders, cell phones and personal digital assistants are becoming part of the mix. Apple announced expanded support for Bluetooth, a technology that provides simple wireless networking among electronic devices.
???The expanded vision includes Apple's iSync application, which allows you to synchronize your Mac's address books and calendars with the ones on handheld devices, including Apple's music player, the iPod.
???Another application, iCal, will allow you to create and manage multiple to-do lists, share calendars with friends, family and co-workers and publish them on the Internet.
???Both applications will be available free of charge in September but will require Apple's new Mac OS X upgrade, Jaguar, to run.
???
Few hardware introductions
???The sole new Macintosh personal computer introduced at the Expo was a version of its flashy flat-panel iMac personal computer with a 17-inch wide-screen liquid crystal display. The existing model has a 15-inch display. Listing for $1,999, the new version of the iMac will go on sale in early August.
???Reaction to the large-screen iMac was positive.
???"I buy new Macs every two years and would seriously consider the 17-inch iMac for my next purchase," said Rich Haug, a longtime user of Macs from Glen Cove, N.Y.
???Apple also quietly upgraded its entry-level $799 iMac, which comes in the original pear-shaped case and has a 15-inch CRT display, with a faster processor and more hard drive storage space.
???In addition, Apple beefed up its iPod music player, which is now available in three models that differ mainly in drive storage space and a hardware bundle that includes a clip-on carrying case and remote control.
???During the latter part of August, Apple will introduce versions of the iPod for the Windows operating system. The company is hoping that the cool technologies embodied in its tiny music player will appeal to Windows users and encourage them to consider switching to Macs.
???
Abandoning free online tools
???First introduced in 2001, Apple's iTools offered several free Internet services, including a mac.com e-mail address, storage space and the ability to set up a free Web site hosted by Apple. All that will be history as of Sept. 30, when Apple phases out iTools and substitutes .Mac, a subscription-based service.
???The new service will roll in the e-mail address, disk storage (increased from 10 megabytes to 100) and personal Web sites. In addition, Apple will include both backup and virus detection software as part of the package, which will cost $100 a year. Existing iTools users can upgrade at $49 for the first year. A 60-day free .Mac trial is being offered by Apple for folks who buy new Macs.
???Mac users who hoped the free services would continue were downbeat about the new policy.
???In a commentary posted on the Low End Mac Web site, John Droz Jr. remarked that "charging for iTools will not increase our market share, in fact ... it may reduce it."

no, I hadn't read that

and it sounds dead on.
what the hell is jobs thinking?

jaguar sounds nice though, and i'm not too suprized at the charged upgrade. didn't they do the same thing from 8 to 8.5 and then to 8.6?

    The only part about the .Mac thing that I'm really bummed about is the loss of the free e-mail addresses. In my opinion, it would have been much smarter for them to continue providing one or two mac.com e-mail addresses for free. I simply host any web sites I make on my ISP's webspace, so the loss of homepage.mac.com is no big deal to me.

    As for the upgrade price, I don't think it's surprising. Apple spent a lot of money on 10.2, and they made enough refinements and additions that charging for it is not unreasonable. I do wish it was a bit cheaper, but hey, what are you gonna do?

Well I think it should be a one time fee, not a yearly payment of $100, that's bullshit.  All you're doing then is renting their 100MB of HD space.  I mean when do you really need 100MB of space for a website, and if you're going to use a bulk of it for backing up, why not just get an external hard drive as it will be a hell of a lot cheaper than a stupid .Mac membership that goes for $100 a year.

But Viper, you're missing out on all the other wonderful features!
a mac.com email adress
FREE software like ical and isync
and you cant forget Virex!

isn't thisworth the $100 a year?!

Brain, if you arent being sarcastic, you are an idiot.

All Mac is trying to do is rip off anybody that they can - faithful mac users included.

well, i would have used scarcasim tags, but they don't convey enough scarcasim to  be anywhere close to adequate.

For the most part, I agree with Apple's decisions to charge people for .Mac and 10.2. The only thing I have a real problem with is taking away all free mac.com email addresses. I really think they should consider allowing users to keep one free email addy. It gives good publicity and the bandwidth required can't be that much relative to how much they use for downloads, hosting their site, etc. As for charging for the rest of .Mac, I support their decision. They are offering a lot of services and that won't be cheap. One thing I think they should do however is offer partial packages. Say something like just email and iDisk for 30 bucks a year. As far as 10.2 goes, just think of it like you are buying lotsa cool applications and getting an OS point release at the same time. It is certainly worth the 70 bucks (education price which applies to the majority here) when you think of it that way.

You are all acting like little spoiled bitches, *oh my god i have to pay for upgrades and services? its not free!*  My god grow up.  Apple spoiles all of us with free updates and upgrades.  If you owned a wintel machine you would have to pay for a new OS then the upgrades for it.  If you owned M$ office its around $100-200 upgrade and PCers don't bitch.  All of us are spoiled and there are ways around it.  Don't stand and bitch go find something else and ignore it.  I hope all of you buy it though =) cause i own apple stock and nothing makes me happier when they report better then estimated earnings.  Apple to us is kinda like a baby we love their computers and what they have done for us so return the favor and pay for the upgrades and the .Mac deal.  Btw its only about $8.33 a month and you can find at least 2 dollars on the ground in a month.  But bitching won't do anything because apple needs money like everyone else.
-moo

No
.Mac for money is Bullshit. I can get everything they offer for free. and who the fuck need antivirus on a mac anyway? ok, macro viruses,  but, cmon. Selfishly, i dont give a fuck about em, being neither an Outlook nor a Word user.

and OS X.2? bah. i like OS 9 better anyway.
maybe i am spoiled. so what? screw em, i dont have any money to spare. Poor student here. I'm sure i wont be the only student looking on hotline etc. for things that apple plans to charge for. Sorry Cow  ;D

macman then get it if you can get it for free some where else but bitching won't do any good

I love apple, but i hope they rott to fuckin hell, b/c they are the worse for any kind of customer realation.

Fuck you have to PAY! for tech support!?!?!

How gay is that shit.

Cow hit it right on the head when he said that the stereotypical Apple loyal user is spoiled. We laugh in the face of all the Windows users for what Microsoft does to them, and when Apple occasionally charges us for something that any other company wouldn't even get noticed if they charged for it, we raise hell.

As far as tech support Dest, I've never had to use it in my entire life because Apple products are MUCH more user friendly than anything else out there. There is also a wealth of freely available knowledge on Apple's site.

.mac is worth it, add up 100megs of bannerfree hosting, email acount with 15megs of space, virex def's for a year and the other features. i'd say its worth it... or at least the 50$ i'm gonna be spending on it, since i'm already a itools customer.
also, i'm getting jaguar, but i don't think i'll use it much till RS runs in X.

$50 for the first year, then $100 per year after.

Also, dont count on RS running in X, no one is going to do a port for that.

well about the tech support issue

i remember one of the mac mags(macworld i think) had one of their writer hang out at apple tech support for a day.

these technitions were often able to come up with the solution before the caller finished the question.(and often they could finish the question for writer before the customer did)

I have only had to use apple tech support once. and all i can say is that these guys are damn good. i believe this was the only call to tech support that i have ever made that actually resulted in a finite answer before i hung up, most other calls  to tech support  i make usually ends with "well, i'm pretty shure that..."

besides with the tech info web site, who needs tech support?

they did say they would be releasing for stuff for .Mac.  Mb in 1-2 years you could be getting a lot of stuff.  There are always upgrades to look at.

I bought OS X.1 for $130 not so long ago.  Now I should not have to pay another $140 for a fucking OS that I already bought.  My god, it's not OS 11, its 10.2!

I agree with Cow...
I love you Cow...
mooooooo...

some(most) of us use Hotline or Carracho... don't we??
well...
I bet you already downloaded some [k]'s and serials, etc...
"stuff for free"?? how much do you think it will cost, all the stuff you already downloaded from those servers??
I have to admit I download "stuff" too but if I realy need it for daily or proffesional use, I buy it, ?MacOs 9 or X(even R6 and RS, lol) is for daily use, so I buy it...
try to support the developers guys, even Apple has its reason why they should charge something for Os X 10.2...
I f you buy a Rolls, you pay for it, the only thing you get for free is the "Rolls-Keychain"

Dude, that's not the point.  People still buy, I buy because I don't feel like taking the chance to download some piece of shit that has a start up worm in it or some app that fucks with my computer.  

Apple think they're gaining control, and we're saying its stupid.  What you're talking about it completely different.

viper you tool if you bought OSX you can get the upgrade for $20
-moo

Last time I checked, Jaguar is not a free update, it's still full price.  Send me a link if im wrong.